Gert & TheBoy's Official VNA Soccer... err Football Thread

[Gert-Jan]

GJ>> << Walt

[rokkerr]

I am thoroughly impressed we have a soccer... I mean football thread....

... been following the games myself a bit. Particularly keen to see where Rooney ends up...

[TheBoy]

Haha, yeah I wonder which City Pellegrini will find himself next season...

Suarez is an interesting one to me: I'm not quite sure how I would feel about him if he was a Spurs player (which he very well could have been had a certain Mr Redknapp not decided he was the same style player as Rafa van der Vaart!). I suppose we've been lucky in never in my memory having had a player who pretty much fans of all other teams disliked with a passion, but to have one who is undoubtedly a world class player must make it very difficult to decide if he is worth the trouble. I think in the end, I would want him sold for a fantastic sum of money as no one person is bigger than the club and then hopefully reinvest in another player of similar ability but with much less hassle.

I'm not in the slightest bit surprised to hear the Vertonghen deal was down to money - Levy seems to get great pleasure from shaving off small amounts of money in any deal, even if it would appear to put any deal at risk! I pray that this season we can get at least the important transfers done relatively early and not go into transfer deadline day once again desperate for a top class striker...

I'm really looking forward to the Champions League final and have to say I'll be supporting Dortmund. There's a few reasons for this - some a little bit petty haha. I still haven't forgiven Bayern for screwing up in last year's final against Chelsea that ended up costing us a place in this years tournament! But more positively, I really like this Dortmund team and it seems to be one that has been built in the right way with a nice blend of players who were perhaps not superstars when they signed, but have now earned that reputation through the team performances. It's a shame that it almost seems inevitable that the team will be broken up so quickly, with Gotze already signed up by Bayern and Lewandowski pretty much certain to leave too. Sahin and Kagawa went a couple of seasons ago (although I think Sahin is back on loan?) and you have to wonder if Hummels and Subotic will hang around if they see the other stars gradually filter away. I really like Klopp too and think he's a very entertaining and intelligent guy. I wonder how long it will be before we have a team like Chelsea or Man City trying to lure him to the Premier League? And if he would be willing to work under the incredibly demanding and trying circumstances or if he would decline the big bucks?

I hope it's a really entertaining game though and we don't get one team 'parking the bus' in order to grind out a cheap victory.

Who will you be cheering on?

Rokker - I wouldn't be totally surprised if Rooney got a move to Chelsea, although where he expects to fit into that team is beyond me... Other than that, I can only really see PSG as someone who can afford to take a punt on him and would maybe want him. I can't see Man City coming in for him again and I'm pretty sure neither Spurs or Arsenal could afford him, not would he want to go there. Maybe one of the big Italian teams might fancy him as a marquee signing though.

It's pretty amazing how his stock has fallen though over the past season or two. I think if Fergie was still the United boss, there is no way Rooney would be there next season. But maybe Moyes can reinvigorate him and he'll have more desire for them again?

Do you follow any team in particular Rokker?

[rokkerr]

I don't really follow any one team... I used to like Leeds as a kid, Portsmouth when I lived in the South of England and Redknapp was a good manager...

... after that it's nice to watch the big matches...

I try to feed Vicky a few games to tweet for free DVDs because she knows zero about football... it's funny how football is still irrelevant in the USA and massive in the rest of the world....

[Gert-Jan]

(...) "as no one person is bigger than the club" (...)

Well said, Drew... and you took the words right outta my mouth with that paragraph about Dortmund as well.

Bayern Munich have the upper hand, or so everybody keeps telling me, lol. I think in the end, though, it's pretty much 50/50. If you look at the Bundesliga ranking this season, Bayern should easily win this Final. They gathered 91 points and only conceded 15 goals in 34 matches. Dortmund, on the other hand, have done extremely well in the matches against Der Rekordmeister. Remember last season? The German Cup Final ended in 5-2 for Borussia Dortmund.

We share quite the same view, Jurgen Klopp is one of my favorite coaches currently active in Europe. Great in analyzing his own- and Germany's national team as well as opponents. One with a good image, which the tabloids obviously don't like. ( He has a pretty good looking wife, btw. ) Don't see him working in England anytime soon, though; he's made for the German competition. Transfer update...Dortmund are trying to persuade Eriksen (Ajax) and Chadli (Twente) to fill the gaps Gotze and Lewandowski leave behind. Where do you see the Polish striker moving to? Bayern Munich? Or a different country?

As for Rooney, Italian clubs can't afford him. And Rooney gets paid how much per week..? Right! The Serie A is not what it used to be in the good ol' days of Juventus winning European cups like Barcelona did past few years. The ancient stadiums are the biggest problem in Italy. Juve are THE number one team again, mainly cause of their brand new arena. Honestly, 18 out of 20 Italian clubs play shitty Football... too defensive.

Pretty sure the CL Final will not be anything like that. No 'parking the bus', lol. I predict 5+ goals... but I have been proven wrong so many times in the past when trying to predict results.

[Fikachu]

@rokkerr
Well, Soccer isn't completely irrelevant in the USA

USA has a talented women's soccer team (even moreso than the USA men's soccer team)

[TheBoy]

Gert-Jan - I think we both appreciate the beautiful side of football (including the hot wives lol) which is why we share a lot of the same views :)

I think that is one of the biggest reasons I started to support Tottenham even though I live nowhere near London. Initially it was the name that drew me in as a 3 year old as the name Tottenham Hotspur just sounded so different to all the city's and united's. Then it was Gary Linekar and a certain Paul Gascoigne that had me hooked, but by then I had the feeling of our tradition of playing fast, attacking football and always trying to win every game. I just don't get these teams who play such negative football and go into games just trying not to let the opponents score. Fair enough there might be the odd game where the best offence is a good defence, but to have it totally as your gameplan would bore me to tears if I had to watch them every week!

I really hope Lewandowski doesn't go to Bayern, purely because German football is providing such great entertainment right now that if Bayern brought two of Dortmund's best players, it might well kill the competition stone dead. It's almost like how Manchester United signed van Persie last season - it made Arsenal even less of a threat whilst also caused Man City to weaken as they planned on signing him too. If RvP had signed for City instead of United, I'd wager the outcome of the league would have been a whole lot closer.

I still think that Ferguson leaving United has thrown spanners into all kinds of works, including Lewandowski. Fergie made lots of positive comments about him and also tipped Dortmund to win the Champions League, which is classic of him when he plans to sign a player! So I was pretty certain he would make a strong challenge to sign the Pole. Now though, will the board back Moyes the same way financially and will top players want to play for him ahead of coaches like Guardiola?

I'm interested to see how Eriksen's career will span out due to having a few Danish friends and I hope very much that he fulfils his potential. I know the Dane's are not totally convinced by him though and fear he might struggle to reach the heights expected of him. But then you don't become an important player at Ajax without having something very special about you, so hopefully he will push on an establish himself as one of the world's best. The rumours around Tottenham are that Tim Sherwood (ex-player and part of the development coaching staff and is part of our 'transfer committee') really wants us to sign him, but that AVB isn't so convinced. Still if Dortmund come in for him then we needn't worry about that ;)

Yeah you're spot on about the Italian league being nowhere near as strong as it used to be although I could still see a team like Inter trying to make a statement similar to that of AC Milan when they shelled out for Balotelli. I'm glad Napoli have managed to have a strong season as I really enjoyed watching them in the previous Champions League due to them playing, well, not Italian football :-p They are/were a bit like this Dortmund team in that the team performances has made stars of players like Cavani, Inler and Hamsik, but again you have to fear that the stars will get picked off and they will once again fade away.

My head says that Bayern will win tonight but my heart hopes for Dortmund. As you pointed out, I don't think that you can take the league into account too much. I think quite early on Dortmund realised the league had been lost and thus concentrated on Europe, which so far has worked out quite well! If I had to make a prediction I'd go with 2-1... to Dortmund. But I'll quite happily take your five plus goal fest :)

Rokker - I think Fikachu has hit the nail on the head and that it appears the USA still perceive 'soccer' to be a kids and women's sport. Although don't discount the TV people too who can't understand how they couldn't show an ad break for at least 45 minutes... The men's team has become a lot stronger over the past decade though for sure. It surprises me really that American's don't push football because purely on the size of the nation, they could quite easily find themselves with a massively talented team capable of winning world cups.

[Gert-Jan]

Interesting Champions League Final with lots of big opportunities to score, but thanks to Neuer and Weidenfeller still 0-0 at half time. The Robben fairytale. The lost Final against Inter in 2010. World Cup Final against Spain, which he could have decided, if Casillias' toe had not prevented him from doing so. Another lost Champions League Final against Chelsea after he missed a crucial penalty. The match between Bayern Munich and the Dutch national team late May 2012, in which Robben got booed by the German fans, blaming him for losing the Final. And now, Saturday May 25th 2013 this historical match. The big cup AND scoring 2-1 in the 89th minute. That's what kids dream about when they're 8 years old and decide they want to become a well known and famous Football player...

Should anyone been sent off... Ribery, Lewandowski, Dante..?? Klopp had obviously done his homework. He prolly told his players something like: "Whenever Bayern have the ball, harry and hassle their defense, put pressure on Dante and he'll just kick the ball away so hard and so far that Subotic and Hummels can start a new attack". I thought we'd be going into extra time, but yep, Bayern won. Congrats to them! Next week the German Cup Final against Stuttart; triple time?

Transfer summer is coming! Monaco are the next Manchester City and PSG. Russian billionaire Rybolovlev will be spending millions and MILLIONS to make sure Monaco are able to compete for next season's title. I like one of his quotes 'round the time he acquired a 66.6 percent stake: "I am a passionate Football fan". Suuuure. He just wants a new toy to play with, lol. Monaco pay €70 million for Porto pair Joao Moutinho and James Rodriguez. Curious to see how this Monaco story continues, though, as next season UEFA will officially be introducing 'Financial Fair Play'. It's the reason Malaga are banned from playing European Football in 2013/2014. Their financial administration is a mess...

Inter hire Mazzari to replace Stramaccioni and Napoli sign Rafael Benitez. Barcelona sign Brazilian superstar Neymar from Santos; 5-year deal and they pay €28 million. Plus, I expect lots of changes in Madrid. Just yesterday Spanish newspaper El Marca reported that Real Madrid are possibly interested in signing Luis Suarez...

[TheBoy]

I enjoyed the Champions League final and the game certainly lived up to it's billing. Yeah I was pleased for Robben as it obviously meant that little (a lot) bit extra to him so it was fitting he grabbed the winning goal. I too thought we were heading for extra time but we should know better these days that the top teams just don't give up. I think Dante was a lucky boy not to be sent off for two yellows - his penalty foul would certainly have gained a yellow were it his first challenge, but overall I would say the referee did a pretty good job. He could have gone over the top sending off a few and really spoiled the game.

I still fear that this Dortmund team might now fade away with Lewandowski sounding like he's very much going to Bayern. If Dortmund do get broken up, I will be interested to see how this affects Bayern in Europe as I believe you need some strong competition in your own league, otherwise you become lazy and expect to roll over teams as you do every week in the league. You'd have to think Bayern will get the better of Stuttgart, but then I suppose it depends on how much beer has been consumed by the players this week lol ;)

The problem Monaco will face is that signing almost top quality players when you are not in the Champions League, it's usually only the huge amount of money that has motivated the players to go there. As Man City found out at first, splashing the cash doesn't instantly guarantee success and then you have a nightmare job trying to get shot of them over the next 5 years. I reckon the financial fair play ruling will always be got around by the big teams. Again with Man City, look at their crazy sponsorship deal for the stadium naming rights, or the rather dubious deal Chelsea have with Gazprom as their 'official global energy partner' whatever the hell that is supposed to be! If memory serves, wasn't Malaga struggling financially last season, to the point where if they lost in the Champions League qualifying round they were preparing for a firesale of players.

I'm looking forward to seeing how Neymar gets on at Barcelona. I can't say I've been terribly impressed by him whenever I have seen him play - he looks like he would fall over at the sneeze of a small child and will need to adjust to being 'just another fish in the pond'. He also needs to work out a partnership with Messi as there will only be one winner between those two if they don't click together...

I suppose it would be strange if there wasn't big changes at Madrid lol. Who do you think they will end with as manager? They seem to want Ancelotti, but would you be surprised if Jupp Heynckes ended up back there if they had to admit defeat in getting the raised eyebrow?

You have to love transfer silly season don't you! Do the newspapers/media outlets in Netherlands often put out obvious bullshit stories about the Dutch teams the same way they do over here? It used to be just the tabloid red top papers that quite obviously made stuff up, but these days the supposed 'higher class' papers are just as bad, if not more so these days.

[Gert-Jan]

Another advantage of playing for Monaco is the fact you do not have to pay taxes... Radamel Falcao is next. Monaco will most likely transfer around €60 million to Atletico Madrid after they bought him from Porto for about €40 million, so that's a pretty good deal for the Spanish Copa Del Rey winner. Also, goalkeeper Victor Valdes is currently in Monaco to negotiate about the terms for his soon to be signed contract.

My personal opinion is that Ancelotti will move to Real Madrid. He's their first choice. The Italian has asked the owner(s) in Paris to cooperate and let him go once Madrid pay what they wanna have. I heard Jupp Heynkes' name come up today, too, but that's just funny... I'd laugh my ass of if that would really happen, lol. He should retire after the amazing season he had with Bayern Munich. A career with many highlights, both as a player and coach.

As for the newspapers during the transfer craziness... people mostly write down facts here. And I just block and ignore the journalists that talk, write, throw bullshit at readers. I've heard and read lots about the way they do it in England. The tabloids are famous, lol. They love writing about players' private lives, right? That's a vital difference compared to Holland. It's all about Football here. Unless your name is Rafael van der Vaart, married to Sylvie van der Vaart, have one son, you're being close friends with Khalid Bouhlarouz, who happens to be a former teammate, whose wife is Sabia Bouhlarouz and best friends forever with Sylvie, and now Rafael Van Der Vaart is having a relationship with Sabia Bouhlarouz! Meanwhile Sylvie is involved with some smooth French dude, but rumours are going around she's actually dating another famous Football player, which is why her relationship with this "Guillaume" is just a cover up story...

It's 3.30am, I'm obviously tired, I should just stop rambling and get my ass to bed.

[CGYMike]

I wonder if Gert-Jan is gunna kick my azz the next time he sees me for putting these gifs into his thread? :)

[TheBoy]

Yeah Monaco are really spraying out the money aren't they? For me, it's disappointing that players of the calibre of Falcao, Moutinho, etc would put the obvious financial gain ahead of ambition to prove themselves at a club expected to challenge in Europe. Sure, they may very well challenge PSG for the French title and then get into the Champions League, but it's plainly obvious these players are not going to Monaco for anything but the money. Although in the case of Falcao, I do wonder if he sees it as the chance to get away from Atletico Madrid for a season and earn a shed load of money before wrangling himself his 'dream move' to Real Madrid?

Yep, I would be surprised if Real did not get Ancelotti. They pretty much always get what/who they want ;)

Oh man, yeah the papers are crazy for gossip on players personal lives over here! Although to be fair, the players don't do themselves many favours when they are stumbling around pissed at 3am the night before a game (or worse still in the eyes of many fans, just after a big loss!). Rafa van der Vaart was by a mile my favourite Spurs player in a long, long time and was absolutely gutted when he had to leave. Although how he could think he is trading up on Sylvie, well, you have to question the man's sanity lol! If he was still in England when all this 'wife swapping' was going on, the papers would have had early Christmas parties ;)

I've just seen that Liverpool have agreed to sign Kolo Toure from Manchester City... that's a bit of an odd one and I'd be a bit worried if I was a Liverpool fan that this is the level of ambition being shown. Obviously they need to replace Carragher, but surely they would want someone who could be playing for many years? I can't imagine his wages are cheap either...

Ah, transfer silly season is upon us and it's not even June 1! :)

[rokkerr]

.... ever been to Monaco?

.... one of the prettiest places on earth. Between Paris & Monaco I would pick Monaco any day. Let's face it... other than diehard football fans, no team in Paris is world famous like Barcelona.....

[Gert-Jan]

Mike, I'd never kick your ass, lol. Good gifs are always fun to watch!

Never been to Monaco, but from what I've seen; it DOES look amazing. While we're out to go grocery shopping, people there buy yachts and rolexes.

Kolo Toure to Liverpool? Replacing one over the hill player by another; weird. Let's see... Monaco news, lol. Ricardo Carvalho has signed a one-year deal with the French squad. Rybolovlev is 119th on the Forbes Rich List 2013, so I kinda fear he's gonna continue this way for a while. And, it got me thinking about how long Ranieri will remain the head coach. Remember when Abramovich took over in London? I'm placing a bet... I predict Ranieri to be the first coach in Ligue 1 to get sacked in 2013/2014.

What's your thought on Moyes bringing the Everton clan to Man United? Mike Phelan had to leave and Rene Meulensteen quit his job last Monday.

[TheBoy]

Ohh, I'm sure there are other very nice benefits to life in Monaco besides the copious amounts of cash these players will be getting ;) But it's fairly safe to say that footballing ambition isn't currently one of them...

I'm quite surprised that they have signed Carvalho as he's getting on a bit now. Fair enough if it was coming towards the end of the transfer window and they still needed a central defender, but you'd think they could afford to sign someone with at least a few more years left in the tank! I've just been reading an article on the potential ban Monaco are facing from playing in Ligue 1 this season due to the tax haven status they have. I hadn't heard of this until today. You'd have to think that some solution will come up to suit both Monaco and the LFP, but it's gonna be interesting to see what that solution is :)

You have to feel a little sorry for Ranieri, don't you? He always seems to get the boot due to being in a job just as big money comes into the club! Maybe this time he will be lucky enough to see the rewards of spending all that money...

I was talking to a friend on Tuesday about Moyes and the backroom staff situation. We were saying it could be more of a hindrance having Sir Alex's staff around him but it would potentially be tough to say that he didn't want them. Now it seems he isn't afraid to axe one or two and one would assume that maybe more might go along with some of his trusted Everton team coming in to replace them. Meulensteen is an interesting one though as I thought he was supposed to be one of football's most highly rated coaches? I'm sure he wont be out of a job for very long, anyway. The GK coach, Eric Steele is also a little surprising as De Gea has improved so dramatically this season that you'd think he would be rather disappointed at being given the old heave ho.

[rokkerr]

Yes so Falcao is now with Monaco .... announced today I think

[TheBoy]

If Ranieri can get them to gel instantly Monaco will have a beast of team (for all 5,300 fans to watch lol) and they should tear up the French league.

[Gert-Jan]

Think I remember reading such article... http://www.theroar.com.au/2013/05/23/as ... o-ligue-1/

Valdes has confirmed he'll leave Barcelona when his contract expires at the end of next season.

Meulensteen started out as technical skills development coach, but over the past decade he had become SO much more than just that. Meulensteen and Phelan were equal and I think it's even fair to say he contributed to the current status of Cristiano Ronaldo. Ofcourse, the superstar is like Messi; born with a magic touch, but he was young and unexperienced when he came from Sporting Lisbon to Man United. I remember him doing all kinds of tricks during a match, but 6 out of 10 times he could not even get passed his opponent, which made the tricks look kinda stupid... let's just say Ronaldo is MUCH more effective nowadays, lol. Meulensteen's experience could be of great value for a club like PSV.

[TheBoy]

I have to say, I do find the Monaco legal situation a little bit curious especially with the reported €200million request from the FFF to ignore their new rule, when lets face it, €8million a year saved in tax is currently chicken feed to the owner. Maybe in the end they will just end up paying the 8 million each season or something?

Who do you think Barcelona will get to replace Valdes? Pepe Reina at Liverpool always seems to be linked and his relationship with Liverpool doesn't seem to be that strong these days. I haven't heard of any hot prospects from within the Barca ranks either so would assume they would be looking to make a purchase.

Have you ever heard of the term 'show pony'? That's exactly what people used to think of Ronaldo at Manchester United until it clicked with that it was a lot easier and much more productive to play like he does now rather than try and do all the fancy flicks (and dives, lest us forget). I'll admit I didn't realise Meulensteen had been at United that long though. The story this morning is that he could become the new manager/head coach of Wigan, which would be a little surprising considering how tough life will be in the Championship. Good luck to him though if he does take the job.

My conviction about Bale staying is seriously starting to sway after the past few days... When you start to hear rumours of Real prepared to offer a staggering £85million for him along with the upcoming presidential elections and potential fan unrest at the poor season and seeing Barca having Neymar signed up, it's starting to be a bit scary! If a bid of that amount came in, I don't think anyone could be angry at accepting it no matter how upset and disappointed they would be :( I'm hoping that this is all posturing by Perez making a show of trying to sign Bale to appease the fans whilst in reality setting things up to try for a deal next summer and in the end perhaps buying Suarez as a 'second prize' this season.

[wshandcock]

USA 4 Germany 2
Sorry Carl